StillSmart

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-09-12T07:32:09+00:00

Trying to replicate a commercially produced spirit is always a mistake No matter what you do it will always be a compromise that you will try to convince yourself is 'close' to the original

Personally, I can't drink commercial spirits like JD anymore as I can always taste the shit in them unless they're drowned in something like Coke and even then....

If you try, you'll find it's actually relatively easy to make a much nicer tasting Whisky when you're not trying to match someone else's taste profile.

A Vodka Star wash, double distilled and aged on some toasted White Oak chips will make a lovely Bourbon Style Whisky and you can then tweak the flavour to produce a spirit that is exactly what you want

AM

Statistics: Posted by Almanac — Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:32 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-09-12T06:00:00+00:00

Easydrinker wrote:
I am glad that you got a result that you are happy with,-that, after all is the only thing that matters.
Robert.

Seconded

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:00 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-09-11T21:22:55+00:00

I am glad that you got a result that you are happy with,-that, after all is the only thing that matters.
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Wed Sep 11, 2013 9:22 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-09-11T17:07:50+00:00

Well I've just come back from overseas so I thought I would invest in a bottle of JD to try the 10% rule.

So I've made 4 litres of home made JD using the SS pack of JD barrel chips the ones that actually smell like a bottle of JD, the result wasn't bad even nice but lacked that JD mmm that I like so into the 4 litres went a litre bottle of JD

I know its not the 10% rule but in fact 20% rule but you know what it was spot on, if you drink JD with a splash of coke and was given this without being told 90% of people would say can I have another.

Hard core neat drinkers would probably know something was up but hey I dont drink it neat, the taste and smell are all there, I know its a little more expensive but I think its the closest I'm gonna get without actually making real JD

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:07 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-12T16:43:44+00:00

Well, I learned very early on that you can't really make a copy of something as familiar and iconic as JD.

I'm happy with the SS tennessee sour mash essence. I'd only drink the genuine article straight or over ice. My stuff I just bury in coke or ginger ale.

As a side note, I did manage to find an agent who sold used JD barrels, the downside was that the "minimum" was a container full........

Statistics: Posted by Phantom — Mon Aug 12, 2013 4:43 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-10T16:25:27+00:00

Easydrinker wrote:
@ Superslim
I started by following the recipe posted here by emptyglass.
I now do not add any sugar until the liquid has been filtered off the other ingredients(makes the filtering easier),and I use a lot less,or it is sickly sweet.
I also throw in a few barrel chunks for colour,not caramel,and I think it improves the taste.
Freezing (and thawing)the peaches before use helps get the flavour out.
It works very well with neutral.

Robert.

Thanks Robert I'll give it a whirl

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Sat Aug 10, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-10T16:11:49+00:00

@ Superslim
I started by following the recipe posted here by emptyglass.
I now do not add any sugar until the liquid has been filtered off the other ingredients(makes the filtering easier),and I use a lot less,or it is sickly sweet.
I also throw in a few barrel chunks for colour,not caramel,and I think it improves the taste.
Freezing (and thawing)the peaches before use helps get the flavour out.
It works very well with neutral.

Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Sat Aug 10, 2013 4:11 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-10T10:36:54+00:00

I think one of the most important lessons I gleaned on my journey along this learning curve is not to try to copy commercially produced products.

Many commercial distilleries do not bother with such niceties as 'cuts' they just chuck it all in the barrel and let the wood sort it out. This has led me to the point where I simply cannot abide spirits like JD or Knob Creek because I can smell the fores/heads and taste the tails

As home distillers we are a little more discerning and take out the nastier heads and tails so, no matter what your wash or wort recipe you will not produce a copy of a commercial spirit like JD.

I simply label mine as JD Style Sour Mash and Bourbon Style Whisky

Once I learned the difference I stopped trying to copy and concentrated on developing a spirit to my tastes but in the style of the commercial spirits I used to like

Also, be careful about letting people outside immediate family and your closest friends know about your stilling activities. Something that's general knowledge in a circle of friends is likely to be discussed or commented on openly and can be overheard by someone you really wouldn't want knowing about your illicit activities.

Plus today's friend could be tomorrow's arresting officer there's nothing like a little paranoia to make you careful

Loose lips can get distillers lifted best rule in this hobby is don't sell and don't tell...anyone

Keep experimenting and you'll come to a spirit you really like and when you do you'll wonder how you ever drank the commercial shit

AM

P.S. I'm officially off the Soap Box now

Statistics: Posted by Almanac — Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:36 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-10T07:57:16+00:00

Thank you for your comments Robert, I do agree it is a little expensive for a home product but the cheapest in Asda is £32 a litre, I don't know why they make it so expensive but I suppose there is a huge market for it, most of my friends don't like it though the ones that do really like it as do I so if it comes out comparable £7-8 aint to bad, I do also like Southern Comfort.
Do you have any good recipes you don't mind sharing using a neutral? I only have a T500 and no pot head so can only make neutral at the moment but that is my problem, think I'll have to start looking for a pot head for my T500

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:57 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-10T00:33:21+00:00

While I will agree that a grain wash,pot-stilled and aged with chunks or chips maybe the the best way to go...
There is logic to your idea,
I have encountered many instances,browsing several forums,where people state that adding some of the finished desired product to the distillate worked wonders,-sometimes as little as 10% of the "desired" product added.
I wish you well in your trial,and please do report back.

I do think it sounds expensive for a home product,but if it floats your boat,then go for it.

My own favourite tipple of the moment is a variation on on the Southern Comfort recipe in this slot,varied with every batch made,and I compare them with great fervour,most evenings.Costs well less than two pounds a litre,including neutral and all ingredients.

Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Sat Aug 10, 2013 12:33 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-09T16:10:26+00:00

Right the nuke method did not produce what I was looking for, whether its the nuke method or the chips I won't know for another 9 days.

I disagree with the comments that you can't make a good JD replica buy using neutral spirit for this reason.....

If you buy a bottle of JD and run it through a reflux still removing the ethanol (alcohol)you end up with 2 products - 1 container of neutral spirit and another container of wash, theoretically unless the boiling process destroys the flavours the wash left behind can be recombined with the separated spirit turning it back into JD, if that is the case then take the wash and reduce down to leave you with a JD essence, if you can recreate that flavour/essence than you can indeed made a good JD replica using neutral spirit. this is of course theoretical and I do not have the time or resources to do this.

So my next trial that I think will get me the closest is to bite the bullet and buy a litre of JD, the 4 litres of neutral I have soaking up the Still Spirits bourbon chips for 10 days will be added to the litre of JD in an attempt to blend in some of the flavour, this will of course add another £6.50 a litre to the price but if it works well I will have produced a decent JD replica for about £7-8 per litre which can't be bad

Wish me luck

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-09T07:34:34+00:00

RumJohn wrote:
I have just read all the posts on "...holy grail" and I have to ask what your base spirit is. I would venture to say it is a neutral. JD starts out with their formula whiskey and ages it in new (as in unused) American white oak. These barrels are only used once by JD.

The Holy Grail will continue to be elusive if using a neutral and essence or JD flavoured wood.

Make yourself a good rye whiskey and age it in or with charred American white oak. You just might get a glimpse of the Holy grail, or at least where it should be.

I would love to do rye whiskey but only having a T500 and no pot head I can only produce a neutral but I do appreciate the advice

Statistics: Posted by Superslim007 — Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:34 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-09T06:41:39+00:00

Yes, Grasshopper, the path to true enlightenment involves using grain alcohol on virgin toasted and roasted American White Oak for 12 months.

However, using a decent neutral with a little late heads, on some JD chunks is not a bad quick fix....I do both and my first REAL whisky will be cracked open for christmas this year

AM

Statistics: Posted by Almanac — Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:41 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-09T01:01:52+00:00

I have just read all the posts on "...holy grail" and I have to ask what your base spirit is. I would venture to say it is a neutral. JD starts out with their formula whiskey and ages it in new (as in unused) American white oak. These barrels are only used once by JD.

The Holy Grail will continue to be elusive if using a neutral and essence or JD flavoured wood.

Make yourself a good rye whiskey and age it in or with charred American white oak. You just might get a glimpse of the Holy grail, or at least where it should be.

Statistics: Posted by RumJohn — Fri Aug 09, 2013 1:01 am

Re: The search for the holy grail - well Jacky D

2013-08-08T21:41:49+00:00

I also have used the still spirit bourbon chunks,from my notes i use 100grm(1 bag) in 4.5 ltr at 40 abv and add 1 bottle of ss top shelf bourbon essence leave for 4 week then add 4 tsp maple syrup filter and bottle,not sure how close to jd this is but my bourbon drinking friends prefer it.i'm just macerating some black cherrys in a bottle of this and awaiting the outcome,fingers crossed
Cheers

Statistics: Posted by billmcc — Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:41 pm