StillSmart

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-12-08T09:35:15+00:00

That picture is showing Lloyd's experiment with porous ceramic beads, which have the advantage of being pretty much maintenance free and should last a lifetime as they are super hard to break and are completely inert.

Once you have bubble sections in the column it really is recommended to go for the 2" Big Baby Dephlegmator. Even if the small baby dephlegmator should give enough reflux with the help of the packed section you loose flexibility in case you want to omit the packed section.

The hearts collection rate during that test run was 1.33 L/h at 95.15% ABV @ 20C without further tweaking, but Lloyd wasn't after max take-off rate for that experiment with the ceramic beads.

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:35 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-12-07T23:33:15+00:00

What's in your packed section? Raschig Rings?

Also is that the baby 2" or big baby 2" dephlegmator?

I would be interested to know what product collection rate you can archive with the 2.5" column, most of us can get 1.2 litres an hour with a 2" column for neutral, it would be interesting to know if you can get closer to 2 litres an hour.

Statistics: Posted by Anavrin — Sun Dec 07, 2014 11:33 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-12-07T20:23:29+00:00

Now you're just showing off

AM

Statistics: Posted by Almanac — Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:23 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-12-07T09:06:21+00:00

For those wondering about the Baby Dragon and a packed section above:

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:06 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T16:52:06+00:00

A realistic upper limmit for a UK domestic supply is 6kW. By my calculations that should run 3x ProCaps per plate. Or 4 (possibly 5) standard caps per plate.

You basically have 2 options for a plated column for flavoured product.

Either run it as a reflux column, product maintained at 90 to 94 ABV for the entire run.

OR Run it like a pot still with attached thumpers. The product ABV drops throughout the run just like on a pot still, but with tighter transitions and a higher overall ABV.

Statistics: Posted by Myles — Tue Nov 18, 2014 4:52 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T13:47:21+00:00

Yes, it's all about the fun as well. We are not just running a business here, but are heavily involved in the Austrian distillers scene. We are officially certified MoB ("Masters of Booze") by the Austrian Chamber of Agriculture and members of the MoB Upper-Austria Association, we attend of lot of tastings of fine spirits and just love good booze. There is a lot going on here in Austria and whenever we participate we write up a report about it. Right now it's all posted to the SD Europe category over at the StillDragon Community Forum, but we are going to start our own blog shortly.

I think you should be fine with a torpedo on top of a T500, no need to go for ProCaps if it's not about maximizing product take-off rate.

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:47 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T12:40:07+00:00

BTW still planning to kep using plain pothead with alembic dome for all grain whisky runs

This kit is to try and improve neutral runs (and have a bit fun as well!)

Statistics: Posted by Admiral Toad — Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:40 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T12:37:02+00:00

Thanks for that

Heat up time isn't much of a problem it usually takes about 110 mins

So you think that the 1800 watts on a T500 boiler should run one 2-4-2" torpedo with the T500 column on top ? If so would the pro cap version be a better bet ? by the way I have a power controller already for this boiler

If so i I think I'll be ordering one up for a try

Longer term I'm sure to look at more bubble plates and alternative boilers

Statistics: Posted by Admiral Toad — Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:37 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T08:45:41+00:00

There are always two sides of the coin. On one hand you will want as much power as possible, but only to shorten the heat up time. During the actual run a lot less power is required.

I know it has been done to run a 4" column with several plates with 2000 to 2200W, but I would not want to operate on the lower limit.

ProCaps per se do not really require more power, but you can put in more power without flooding the plates. You usually may want put in about 10% more power during normal operation to feel the benefit of the ProCaps, pushing it to the limit for max take-off rate does not benefit the product quality, but we are talking mostly about distilleries working on the hour (but then you would go for a larger column diameter, larger boiler and a lot more power instead).

I can't tell how far you can go with a T500 and it's 1800 or 2000W, but it should do well with a Baby Crystal Dragon with 3 or 4 bubble sections. The next big hit will be our 30L stove-top boiler with Baby Crystal Dragon available in January, put that one on a 1800-2000W induction stove and you are definitely good to go as well. A lot of excitement on our side.

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Tue Nov 18, 2014 8:45 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T06:31:27+00:00

cheers Brian these are the sort of things I want to check to see if it's a go-er for me and others

You're correct about the T500 wattage so do others and Michael at stilldragon think this may be a problem

In truth I would love to jump up to a 4" system but in practical reality (and to keep the peace) the size of 2" kit and 30 litre boilers makes more sense

Statistics: Posted by Admiral Toad — Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:31 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T03:40:12+00:00

Easydrinker wrote:
YHB wrote:But. You need a lot more power.

Unless I am in total brain-fart mode I do not see this or what you are trying to say Brian.
Elucidation?
Robert.

-----------------------------
Just that - you will need more power.

Most of us here appear to run packed columns and are looking to upgrade. With a 2" packed column in reflux mode you need 1 to 1.5 kw of power, Any additional power is useful to bring the still up to temperature more quickly but not needed for production.

To get bubble caps working efficiently you need more power, from what I can see most people with a 4" bubble plate use over 3 kw of power during production.

The Pro-cap 36 appears to need between 2 to 2.5 kw per cap. this is the design I am basing my build on and therefore with my boiler I am limiting myself to a single cap, any more and the still would not work as it should.

So my statement "You will need more power" was simply a general heads-up for consideration by anyone thinking of upgrading. But particularly Admiral Toad who has a T500 boiler and I believe is limited to 1800W.

Statistics: Posted by YHB — Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:40 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T01:10:01+00:00

YHB wrote:
But. You need a lot more power.

Unless I am in total brain-fart mode I do not see this or what you are trying to say Brian.
Elucidation?
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:10 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-18T00:50:54+00:00

Fair point!
The Brits and their attempts at making the world use correct grammar.
Sometimes we over enthuse.
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:50 am

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-17T16:23:29+00:00

BTW I can see that it's often written wrong here, because it's StillDragon without a space in between. If you search for "Still Dragon" with space you will most likely find a rock band, a video game and a roller coaster called like that.

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:23 pm

Re: Bubble plates and Still Dragon kit

2014-11-17T15:49:06+00:00

Already well explained above.

Each bubble plate acts as distillation stage, considered an amplifier. The boiler itself counts a first distillation stage, each subsequent bubble section or packed section adds to it.

Together with a dephlegmator you run it as real (active) reflux column, and with cooling management you can control the product take-off speed and with that the collection ABV. The larger the column diameter and the more power you put in the fast you can collect at high ABV, the number of plates / packed section give you control over the purity of the distillate.

Using three distillation stages (above the boiler) is a good start to produce flavored spirits like whiskey or (fruit) brandy in one go, which is a huge advantage compared to pot-stilling with stripping and spirit runs. Since 3 plates + dephlegmator is the max allowed here in Austria for unbonded stills it's what all the farmers use and I can tell you that they produce excellent brandies and whiskeys that way.

Statistics: Posted by SDeurope — Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:49 pm