StillSmart

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-06-10T05:29:24+00:00

Ian3266 wrote:
Keystone wrote:The recipe below is geared for 3 x 20 L

For 62 L:

12 kg .. sugar
9 ......... crushed multivitamin tablets (simmered in hot water to release nutrients)
1/2 t ... epsom salt
3 T ...... DAP (SNA of 1 T per day over three days with aeration)
150 g .. bakers yeast pitched at 35C/95F
3 t ....... ascorbic acid
50 g .... boiled yeast

Note: maintain 26C/78F throughout fermentation to achieve .990 SG within 5 days/120 hours. An aquarium heater would provide a consistent temperature environment for the ferment.

************************************************************************

Hi mate

Could I pick your brains a little. I have been trying to find a reliable easy sugar wash for some time now and have tried several with mixed results. Yours bears a resemblance to the wash I'm currently fermenting, the "Wineos Plain Old Sugar Wash" (WPOSW), with some obvious differences.

He uses mostly similar nutrients as you but at a much lower level, he also massively overpitches yeast compared to yours, quoting for bakers in a 25 ltr wash half a cup, a US cup that is, being I believe for half a cup about 120 mils or pretty much a full tin of Alinsons bakers, or 125gms.

Now I don't have a problem with bakers yeast per se but its not generally regarded as being good at clearing and with this much yeast I think I may have problems getting it anywhere near clear.

I a few questions.

Firstly I notice you advocate a clearing agent, do you have clearing issues with bakers yeast.

Have you ever tried different yeasts to improve clearing performance, we don't seem to be as lucky as in the US or Oz with regard to access to distillers yeast etc but I have seen Youngs Dried Active Wine and Beer Yeast (100 gram Tub, note not the Youngs Super Wine Yeast with added nutrients. I just wondered if you'd tried it or had a any thoughts. I have used with good results Lalvin KV 1116 but at these sort of pitching rates would be expensive

I notice you advocate simmering your vit tabs, I've recently been reading about some vits, notably B1 & B2 being destroyed by boiling, I wasn't aware of it and have boiled them myself in the past.

You use ascorbic acid, I have citric would it make much difference.

Your recipe looks like something I should be aiming for, sorry for all the questions.

Regards Ian3266

Sorry for the late reply as I had been busy with Chilean winemaking.

Ascorbic acid is used to help the yeast absorb the nutrients to speed up the process while striving for a clean wash. Ascorbic acid cleans up sulfides in the wash.

Bakers yeast can settle out with time, in a chest freezer set at 33 F/ 1 C over a couple of days or using one's preferred clearing agent over 24 hours. It all depends on one's threshold for patience.

Statistics: Posted by Keystone — Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:29 am

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-05-02T15:25:04+00:00

It doesn't really matter how much yeast we pitch because if we aerate the wash prior to pitching it, the yeast multiplies aerobically using the oxygen. If you were to remove it at that point you would see that it had multiplied enormously.

I have just done two washes one after the other and I used the old yeast from the last wash and added it to the next.

The second wash was done in 2 days (I thought it had stuck) but this was because the large amount of yeast I added, grew so that there was a huge amount in the wash at the end.

It still cleared out and ran through the still fine. Worry not about yeast quantity. Simply make sure there is plenty of air in the wash prior to pitching and you'll be fine.

Sorry for hijacking your recipe thread YHB, just wanted to clear that up. Thanks for sharing your recipe, I'll give that one a shot.

Statistics: Posted by ErnieV — Thu May 02, 2013 3:25 pm

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-04-28T05:25:09+00:00

Ian,

You are asking about two things yeast and nutrients,

Firstly yeast,

I am not really in a position to compare bakers and brewers yeasts because I have never tried the brewers stuff. The first wash I made was with bakers yeast, it worked for me and have never had the need to try the other more expensive stuff.

I use half a tin of Allison's for a 25 litre wash, if I used half that amount it would still work it might take a bit longer and similarly I could use the whole tin. Cost wise it is insignificant and I think that is why you see such widely varying amounts quoted in recipes.

The only problems I have had with the brewing have been due to temperature and never had a wash fail due to the yeast I usually use 5kg of sugar for a 25 litre wash, but I had a brain fart on the last two runs of All Bran and used 6kg in each, it fermented out fine and with no off tastes.

I have not had any trouble with the washes clearing. They clear in time, maybe brewers yeast clears faster. If I need to speed to speed things up I use Wliko's finings at a pound a shot, if I need to really speed things up I use two.

So my quantities can vary by hundres of percents, depends on the mood I am in at the time and not on any scientific basis, if I wrote my recipes down they would appear to be totally different methods.

Secondly Nutrients

I have never made a sugar only wash, I have thought about it and probably will in the near future. I like you have seen many variations in types and quantities of ingredients, I put it down to the same reasons as I used for yeast type.

You say that you currently have a wash going now. If it works for you why change it? do you want it quicker, cheaper or to taste better?

The more I make the less nutrients I use - some of these vitamin tables taste vile - Rum and TPW I do not add any additional nutrients at all, they may take a few days longer but I prefer it that way.

If you have not come across it yet and are still looking for an alternative then have a look at Capt'n C's yeast bomb thread, viewtopic.php?f=2&t=663&start=15#p5737

I do not know if that helps in the slightest, just my thoughts on the subject and I wanted to say Hello.

Toodlepip

Statistics: Posted by YHB — Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:25 am

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-04-27T21:43:24+00:00

If thats an answer to me then I dont understand it

Statistics: Posted by Ian3266 — Sat Apr 27, 2013 9:43 pm

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-04-27T17:28:04+00:00

Read that again, "The recipe below is geared for 3 x 20 L ". You would want 1/3 of these amount for a 23L wash.

Statistics: Posted by chill — Sat Apr 27, 2013 5:28 pm

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-04-27T14:55:44+00:00

Keystone wrote:
The recipe below is geared for 3 x 20 L

For 62 L:

12 kg .. sugar
9 ......... crushed multivitamin tablets (simmered in hot water to release nutrients)
1/2 t ... epsom salt
3 T ...... DAP (SNA of 1 T per day over three days with aeration)
150 g .. bakers yeast pitched at 35C/95F
3 t ....... ascorbic acid
50 g .... boiled yeast

Note: maintain 26C/78F throughout fermentation to achieve .990 SG within 5 days/120 hours. An aquarium heater would provide a consistent temperature environment for the ferment.

************************************************************************

Hi mate

Could I pick your brains a little. I have been trying to find a reliable easy sugar wash for some time now and have tried several with mixed results. Yours bears a resemblance to the wash I'm currently fermenting, the "Wineos Plain Old Sugar Wash" (WPOSW), with some obvious differences.

He uses mostly similar nutrients as you but at a much lower level, he also massively overpitches yeast compared to yours, quoting for bakers in a 25 ltr wash half a cup, a US cup that is, being I believe for half a cup about 120 mils or pretty much a full tin of Alinsons bakers, or 125gms.

Now I don't have a problem with bakers yeast per se but its not generally regarded as being good at clearing and with this much yeast I think I may have problems getting it anywhere near clear.

I a few questions.

Firstly I notice you advocate a clearing agent, do you have clearing issues with bakers yeast.

Have you ever tried different yeasts to improve clearing performance, we don't seem to be as lucky as in the US or Oz with regard to access to distillers yeast etc but I have seen Youngs Dried Active Wine and Beer Yeast (100 gram Tub, note not the Youngs Super Wine Yeast with added nutrients. I just wondered if you'd tried it or had a any thoughts. I have used with good results Lalvin KV 1116 but at these sort of pitching rates would be expensive

I notice you advocate simmering your vit tabs, I've recently been reading about some vits, notably B1 & B2 being destroyed by boiling, I wasn't aware of it and have boiled them myself in the past.

You use ascorbic acid, I have citric would it make much difference.

Your recipe looks like something I should be aiming for, sorry for all the questions.

Regards Ian3266

Statistics: Posted by Ian3266 — Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:55 pm

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-03-13T03:09:57+00:00

I've tried this and the staggered nutrient addition does seem to keep the yeast happier. Perhaps if you add it all at once, they get too excited early in the ferment.

Chuck

Statistics: Posted by chill — Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:09 am

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-03-12T08:39:02+00:00

Hi Mickey
Your entitled to your own opinion. Ivw been stillin for nearly five years now and use bakers yeast (Allinsons Dried Yeast) all the time. Makes for a fantastic product and fairly cheap at Sainsbury or Tesco. So please dont mock the product and sway others from using it.
Regards
Runningman

Statistics: Posted by Runningman — Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:39 am

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-03-12T03:35:56+00:00

mickeyhogg - what makes you think bakers yeast will produce an inferior product. I use nothing but bakers yeast. Results are just fine.

Statistics: Posted by RumJohn — Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:35 am

Re: Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-03-12T01:02:34+00:00

Why are you going to all this trouble for,using bakers yeast will only produce an inferior product,use a distillers yeast and end up with a drinkable product

Statistics: Posted by mikeyhogg — Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:02 am

Staggered Simple Sugar Wash

2013-01-20T04:08:20+00:00

The recipe below is geared for 3 x 20 L strip runs. For a 21 L wash, divide the ingredients below by three. The recipe is designed to yield a 11% wash. The DAP is to be added as a staggered nutrient addition (SNA) over three days and prior to pitching the yeast on day one. The wash should be aerated prior to the time of pitching the yeast on day one and the second SNA on day two. The wash should be gently stirred to release CO2 prior to the third SNA on day three. At the end of the ferment, use a clearing agent prior to the run.

For 62 L:

12 kg .. sugar
9 ......... crushed multivitamin tablets (simmered in hot water to release nutrients)
1/2 t ... epsom salt
3 T ...... DAP (SNA of 1 T per day over three days with aeration)
150 g .. bakers yeast pitched at 35C/95F
3 t ....... ascorbic acid
50 g .... boiled yeast

Note: maintain 26C/78F throughout fermentation to achieve .990 SG within 5 days/120 hours. An aquarium heater would provide a consistent temperature environment for the ferment.

Statistics: Posted by Keystone — Sun Jan 20, 2013 4:08 am