StillSmart

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-20T10:54:13+00:00

Corps012588 wrote:
Wow phantom. That was truly an in depth answer and just the sort of response us newer
People need to help us understand what can initially seem a difficult and and sometimes bewildering hobby
Now I tried some of the yeast in a glass with some sugar and 28c water and it frothed up lovely within 15 minutes.
I was and still am a little unsure as to wether the nutrient is still any good so I think I'm just gonna have to try it and the yeast in a sugar wash just as soon as I have a fermenter free.
As a guideline for 25l how much nutrient should I use?

S' about knowing where the different process types start and finish, plus where the parallels are (some of which work, some 'ish and some not).

What yeast is it and what nutrient ?

Plus if you're happy witb the yeast, just go to Lidl or Aldi and get 5 litres of apple or grape juice and 3lb of cheap honey.

2lb honey and 4 ish litres of the juice, in a bucket (air lockable). Stir the bejesus out of it and pitch yeast. Make sure you take an SG. Once you've go bubbles add a tsp of the nutrient. Test and stir daily, then when you hit the 1/3rd break another tsp nutrient and final stir, airlock and let it finish....

Well thats what I'd do anyway.....

Statistics: Posted by Phantom — Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:54 am

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-20T08:27:51+00:00

Wow phantom. That was truly an in depth answer and just the sort of response us newer
People need to help us understand what can initially seem a difficult and and sometimes bewildering hobby
Now I tried some of the yeast in a glass with some sugar and 28c water and it frothed up lovely within 15 minutes.
I was and still am a little unsure as to wether the nutrient is still any good so I think I'm just gonna have to try it and the yeast in a sugar wash just as soon as I have a fermenter free.
As a guideline for 25l how much nutrient should I use?

Statistics: Posted by Corps012588 — Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:27 am

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-19T07:45:45+00:00

The problem with most nutrient here is that its produced by shit heads that don't want or can't post enough info.

There's a strong chance that just using sugar and nutrient levels as printed on labels leaves a batch underfed.

A good example are meads (especially traditionals) as honey is 80% plus sugar. The only real way to get it right is to have some knowledge of its make up and the only proprietary brand of nutrients that publish that is Lallemands Fermaid range. It provides about 120 ppm nitrogen per gramme per litre and given that brews in the 12 to 13% ABV range can need 250 ppm and those up to 18% ABV can need in the 350 to 400 ppm area, so it'd be quite easy for sugar wash to not go dry.

Especially if you presume a lack of any inherent nutrient in the sugar (same as honey). So no only does it (the yeast) need nitrogen, but the other elements to help it ferment cleanly, a good example being thiamin a.k.a. vit B1 which the lack of, can cause a rotten egg/H2S stink early in the ferment.

Of course, if you presumed a similar level of nitrogen in tronozymol as is found in Fermaidk, then you can boost the nitrogen with DAP which provides about 200 ppm, so a mix of both and the nearest to pure DAP in the UK would by youngs yeast nutrient.

As for the old yeast ? Just make a starter. If that's working it should be good to go. If nothing happens then just add it to the batch once something else has been used to start the ferment. Dead yeast provides nutrient for live and yeast isn't fussy about cannibalism.......

What's all that rambling mean ? It means yes, wine yeasts and nutrient work fine for making sugar wash.......

Dunno if there's any pH swing problems with wash, like you can get with meads though. Never thought to test buckets of wash for that.......

Statistics: Posted by Phantom — Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:45 am

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-14T04:43:57+00:00

John,that could be it.
Nail,head ,hit the, on the.
Re-arranging the above line does it for me.
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:43 am

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-13T15:07:59+00:00

Easydrinker wrote:
"Wine nutrients aren't suitable for making a sugar wash, tried that and failed 20 years ago."

Nothing personal John,but I have to disagree with you here.I recently used some aged tronozymol in a plain sugar wash with bread yeast,fermented well,finished well dry.

I shall now step back,off your toes.
Robert.

Maybe the bread yeast made the difference? I used wine yeast plus of course, wine type quantities of sugar and it never got close to dry. Can see it working with a low enough starting SG but lots more wash needed per litre of 40% neutral.

Statistics: Posted by John51 — Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:07 pm

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-13T10:38:37+00:00

Sorry for the confusion. It was only the yeast I tried in a cup with sugar.
I haven't done anything with the nutrients yet.
Is there an optimal amount of bakers yeast for a 25l wash?
I put on a barley sugarhead and used quite a bit as I wasn't too sure how much to use.
The wash is just clearing and seems ok, fingers crossed.
Thanks for the constant help and guidance guys

Statistics: Posted by Corps012588 — Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:38 am

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-12T23:22:05+00:00

"Wine nutrients aren't suitable for making a sugar wash, tried that and failed 20 years ago."

Nothing personal John,but I have to disagree with you here.I recently used some aged tronozymol in a plain sugar wash with bread yeast,fermented well,finished well dry.

I shall now step back,off your toes.
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:22 pm

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-12T19:28:38+00:00

Wine nutrients aren't suitable for making a sugar wash, tried that and failed 20 years ago. Less than a quid for bakers yeast if doing a TPW and you'll get a good few washes out of it.

The demijohns will clean up lovely with VWE and you can make some country wines to compliment your spirits. Or even as a base for distillation but go easy on sulphur products if so, it comes through into the distillate. Guess how I know that?

Statistics: Posted by John51 — Tue Nov 12, 2013 7:28 pm

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-12T17:33:19+00:00

Tried a level tsp of the yeast in 28c water with 2tsp of sugar and after 10 minutes it had a lovely head.
Should it be ok to use for washes?

Statistics: Posted by Corps012588 — Tue Nov 12, 2013 5:33 pm

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-11T23:36:41+00:00

Date on the nutrient is largely irrelevant, use it.

Campden tablets will probably be fine too if they've been sealed properly.

Dried yeast's viability can be extended if it's refrigerated but otherwise will diminish rapidly. It might still work if you double the quantity, but personally I would bin it.

Statistics: Posted by GrunthosTheFlatulent — Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:36 pm

Re: Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-11T22:42:05+00:00

For sure nutrients and the like live forever,I have recently used some priced in LSD,from an old(er) geezer that I know.
Yeast can be more delicate,and temperamental.
Try dropping a little in some wort and see what happens...?
Robert.

Statistics: Posted by Easydrinker — Mon Nov 11, 2013 10:42 pm

Out of date yeast and nutrient

2013-11-11T22:05:48+00:00

Hi all. Earlier today I was talking to an old lady who lives near me and it turned out her late husband was into home brew.
She went on to tell me I was welcome to his old bits that were left
There were demijohns and a 25l fermenter. When I opened the fermenter it had loads of pots of youngs yeast, yeast nutrient, campden tablets etc.
These are all dated 2010.
Is there any chance they may still be usable? Seems a shame if not

Statistics: Posted by Corps012588 — Mon Nov 11, 2013 10:05 pm