Flaked maize advice, please.

[Jolly John]

Hi. Just joined this morning, so hello to everyone. I'm based in the UK, and would like some advice on the best way to mash flaked maize. I want to make a "bourbon" style whiskey, 65% corn, 20% wheat and 15% malted barley (Maris Otter). My choice of ingredients are, cornflour (course polenta), flaked maize, torrified wheat, wheat malt and of course malted barley. I'm fully conversant with the mashing process, having brewed all grain beers for many years, and have the usual "Burco" boiler and "picnic box" mash tun. My question is: which of the corn, and wheat options would you use, and if flaked maize, what method of mashing would you use?

My new "Boka" is all ready to go, just completed the vinegar cleaning run, and about to run the sacrificial sugar wash.

Cheers, John.

[Capt-Cudellez]

Welcome to the forum. I haven't used flaked maize before so I'll let someone else jump in.

Just wondering if you're after a bourbon then why did you go for a boka, it will produce a high ABV spirit at the expense of some of the flavour. For that style of drink with a grain base, its hard to beat a couple of passes through a simple pot still.

Have fun.

CC.

[Jolly John]

I will use the method that Smiley recommends in his book "Making Pure Corn Whiskey", where feints from previous runs are added to the spirit run, and cuts made to taste. I'll probably collect in small jars, then blend later, at least 'til I get used to the recipe and new still.

[Icefever]

Hi & Welcome JJ...

I'm a newbie myself, so I'll just say hello and leave this Q to the masters..

[Capt-Cudellez]

Ah right, I've not read that one yet. But I believe odin from the other forums is a real fan of that process.

I'm sure it will produce a tasty spirit, if slightly lighter. Might be a good one if keeping it white, pot stilled stuff needs quite a while on wood, where I like column run rum kept white.

[Jolly John]

I've had the book for years, if you want to have a look, here it is:

http://curezone.com/upload/Members/Chaz ... illers.pdf

[Icefever]

I've had the book for years, if you want to have a look, here it is:
http://curezone.com/upload/Members/Chaz ... illers.pdf

Thanks for the link....it's a good read.

[Jolly John]

I've had the book for years, if you want to have a look, here it is:
http://curezone.com/upload/Members/Chaz ... illers.pdf

Thanks for the link....it's a good read.

You're welcome. My copy lives on the bedside table.

[Almanac]

I can offer three pieces of advice for your quest;

1 If you want to make Bourbon or Sour Mash or any Whiskey (Whisky) you should use a pot still and not a reflux column. You can make these spirits using a Fractionating column but you really shouldn't. The result will not be all that it can be. Ian Smiley's book is a great read but I always viewed it as a foray into the possible rather than "the way it should be done".

2 Using Flaked Maize is a problem. Flaked Maize is pre-cooked and doesn't require much processing other than soaking in boiling water to dissolve and gelatinise the starch and that's where the problem begins because it will turn to quick-set concrete in seconds. When this happens, add cold water to reduce the temperature of the mash to 80oC and leave it for about 10 minutes then add more cold water to bring the temp down to 70oC, stir well to break up any remaining jelly clumps then add the Malted Barley and Rye. Stir well then leave for about 60 mins then stir again before leaving for a final 30mins. I hope you have a really good filter manifold in your tun but it will work...in the end, but really messy.

3 If you want to make good Bourbon drop the Wheat and substitute Malted Rye as 10% of the grain bill and increase the % of Barley. Maris Otter will do at a push but see if there is a Grain Maltster anywhere near you that you can buy Distillers Malt from.

Have a read of this and see if you can find anything useful in it download/file.php?id=23

Whatever you do good luck with it and keep us posted and plenty of pics too

AM

[Easydrinker]

Firstly,Jolly John welcome.
Secondly,thank you for the link to the book,-downloaded and read today.

I liked some of it and found it interesting.
Some,I dis-agreed with,based upon personal experience.

I agree with all Aidanmac stated above,but the night is too short for me to list all the points in Ian Smiley's book I take issue with.

With the best intention,may I suggest you read some more books,and experiences and treat this one as a "Gospel" and not a "Bible"? By that I mean that it contains some information,but not the whole of it,nor necessarily the best.

Whatever your path,I wish you distilling heaven.

Robert

[Jolly John]

Wow! Thank you all for the replies, and good feedback. Not sure I'm any the wiser, as far as flaked maize goes, but it does sound like its a bit of a bitch to handle. I've made quite a bit of whiskey using cornflour in the past, which was successful, meant boiling for a while, but sounds easier than struggling with flaked maize.

Thanks for the info Aidenmac, I will try rye, but I fancy going with wheat to start with. I also fancy giving it a go with the reflux column, Odin seems to be doing ok with it. If it doesn't work, at least I'll have got it out of my system, and I can knock up a simple pot still attachment with liebig for my keg.

For the meantime, I'll probably stick with making gin, and some liqueurs for the missus!

[Jolly John]

Thanks for the link Aidenmac, I will give this method a try, apart from the lower mash temperature, its more or less what I do for beer making. I will try using my cool box which has a perforated copper pipe filter system, should work OK, fingers crossed. It looks like a better method than fermenting on the grain, then straining.

[Almanac]

It looks like a better method than fermenting on the grain, then straining.

Fermenting 'on the grain' is a reference you come across on US forums because they have access to cheap and plentiful supplies of corn kernels which can be cracked just enough to allow access to the starch inside We poorer cousins, on this side of the pond, have to make do with flaked maize which is a different proposition altogether and does not lend itself well to being included in the fermentation process

AM

[Jolly John]

Yeah, I can't find a good supply of crushed corn here, but I'm yet to try any of the farm, animal feed suppliers, then again, don't know what else may be in animal feed. Flaked maize, brewing quality, I can get for about £22.00 for a 25 kilo sack, same for wheat and barley malt. One thing I may have to do, is construct a larger mashing box, the larger quantities of grain needed to produce whort that will ferment to around 8%, will be a struggle. My normal beer mashes are for about 4-5% ABV.

I've just found some flaked maize for dog food, £9.00 for 25 kilo....might try it.

[Almanac]

I got my Flaked Maize from an Equestrian Feed supplier. Just make sure it contains nothing but Maize and particularly no preservatives

Over here a 25Kg bag of Flaked Maize costs just 12 Euros, so £22 seems extremely steep cause things ain't cheep over here anymore

Whole Corn kernels or even cracked Corn is plentiful and cheap in the US cause the stuff is grown everywhere. In this part of the world Corn is grown only as an animal feed crop and the quality isn't very good. Certainly not up to the standard of the lovely sweet corn grown in the US where they make all sorts of thing from it like Corn Syrup and Corn Dogs In this part of the world we use it to feed horses so there's not that much emphasis on quality - foodwise

While the Maize grown in this part of the world, for animal feed, may not be as tasty as the Corn grown elsewhere, for human consumption, it can still be used for making Whisky but we should remember that the only reason Corn was used for making Bourbon was because it was cheap and plentiful and available.

I make, what my palate tells me is, quite good Bourbon using Malted Barley - no Corn/Maize. The majority of the flavour comes from the Toasted American White Oak but I do add a little unmalted barley to my thumper on the Spirit Run and it does make a nice difference to the final spirit

AM