Step Mashing

[Benoit]

I have no clue where to post this but it seems a technique often used by beer makers so here it goes! I have ordered some rye with the intention of a thoroughbred rye whiskey & thought it best to get my head round what it's going to need. It would seem to be quite the pain in the backside, not as bad as corn but well on its way and then I stumbled across this:



If I followed the various steps on that graph, it seems I will end up with a thin dry wort / wash with little body & no head...is that right? Granted if it was for beer to drink it's not going to win any awards but I'm not after beer, I don't want any body or head that might make my still puke & I certainly don't want any sugars left unfermented.
I'm either going to go for a 100% rye or possibly 80/20 with some barley, although I have ordered peated barley & I'm not sure it will work with the rye, flavour wise?
Here's the article if anyone fancies a read:
https://byo.com/mead/item/1497-the-scie ... ep-mashing

Does anyone else step mash their worts? It's quite a lot different from the usual "chuck it into 70° water & seal up the cool box" approach

[Easydrinker]

Is this of any help
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=3928

Robert.

[Benoit]

Definitely thank you Robert, do you suffer with much foaming/puking from all grain washes?
As soon as it arrives I will be experimenting so I will keep you all posted on the progress, it's the 30°c & 40°c rests that really interest me as they are supposed to activate the protein reactive enzymes & limit the thing turning into dough.
Do you mind me asking the theory behind the step at 85°c?

[Anavrin]

85°c is usually to mash out, ie stop the conversion, 85°c is also a normal temp for sparge water.

Not sure it's nessesary for making an AG wash, especially if adding further enzymes like Gluco Amylase (AKA Amylglucoladase)

[Mash]

From the research I have done, I am coming to the conclusion there is actually little similarity between making AG beer (ale) and beer (wash).

I think I am going to clear my head and follow moonshine steps to make a wash, rather than try to rework my ale steps.

Thoughts?

[Benoit]

First thought was "what are moonshine steps?!"

[Mash]

That was the only thing I could think to call them.
To my mind they seem to be completely different to Ale - Perhaps it is me just trying to compartmentalise them.

[Icefever]

First thought was "what are moonshine steps?!"

Light ones I would say....

[Toper]

As I understand it, a stepped mash increases enzyme activity which producing a wash, though possibly unsuitable for beer production due to lack of body,, has maximum starch conversion, producing a more highly fermentable wash.



Suggested rests are at 45, 62 and 73 °C (113, 144 and 163 °F). Finally going up to 78 °C (172 °F) for the Mashing Out.

The intial low temperature rest does appear to increase the acidity of the wash.

It is far most attention intensive than a single mashing rest.

[Mash]

Spot on. Thanks much better than I could have done.

[Benoit]

Some real good info flying round here the last few days, thank you mash & toper. So from that chart I will need some bicarbonate on hand to raise the ph as the temp comes up?

[Toper]

There are those who argue that for a wash to have optimum acidity for a yeast to function at its best, its final ph, before throwing the yeast, should be about 5.2 .

Personally, I have run washes at 4.2 after a stepped mash, using a whisky yeast, and been more than satisfied with the fermentation results. Mind you, my Chinese ph meter could be as wonky as some of their hydrometers I've bought in the past.

I think simply that although ale brewing brings a lot to the table in terms of mashing experience, we are not producing ales and so, maybe, we should be prepared to depart from, what cannot be denied, their successful results in mashing for ale making.

[Mash]

Toper, Presumably you are doing 45c & 73c, for about 10 minutes ?

[Toper]

I have been using a 30 minute period at each temperature level, ignoring the brief interval for the rise from one temperature level to the next.. The final mash out heat being held for 10 minutes.

The whole mashing procedure taking about 110 minutes.

[Easydrinker]

First thought was "what are moonshine steps?!"

Light ones I would say....

Are there 49 of them?

Seriously, the numbers that spring to mind come from my favourite Islay distillery, Bunnahabhain.
First water 64°C
Second water 80°C
Third water 90°C
AND yes Fourth water 90 °C.

And using yeast grown for them, but probably closer to the average bread yeast than the dried "whiskey" yeast available in your local HBS.
And they use bucket loads, 2% by weight of Barley used in a mash.
Because they want 3 or 5 day ferments.
Where they lead, I will follow.

Robert.