Gin

[Maker]

I've been reading and youtubing for a while now and I'm getting conflicting answers so I'll ask you guys if that’s ok. Her who must be obeyed wants gin, I don't like it, well I don't like what I have tasted so far in life but I appreciate what you guys produce may change that.

1. Do I need to build another still so I don't contaminate the one I have, I read the flavours will taint other runs, if so will the keg boiler be ok to reuse or should I make another. I have spare parts so can knock one up quite cheaply and easily.

2. I don't see a definitive design for a gin still, is just simple pot still the way to go, keg, short column to hold botanicals, bend, condenser, collect gin.

3. On youtube istill is banging on about putting botanicals in the wash as the contact area is much greater and more flavour in imparted so can be watered down with more spirit to get more end product, you guys only talk about suspending botanicals in the vapour path, what's best?

4. Is it best to make gin with strip in the boiler or finished spirit in the boiler, I read about making cuts but if you are using spirit in the boiler surely you don't need to make cuts as it has been cut already.

5. Where is the line drawn in regards to what is a gin, surely some of these craft gin's are actually flavoured vodka if juniper is not prominent.

[Easydrinker]

I am not claiming to have the correct answers to your questions.
Just my opinions.
1.Botanicals can taint a still, how you use them, and how easy it is to clean your still and condenser are key.
2.Yes, a simple pot still, botanicals in a basket or the wash.
3.How long is a piece of string? People will always argue this point.
4.Always make Gin with the best spirit available.
And you will discover that the first and last from the still are NOT drinkable.
5.I believe that by definition Gin must contain Juniper and Corriander, anything else is simply 'craft'.

Robert.

[Mash]

Get in - hold on tight....

1. Do I need to build another still.
Ans: IMO no, that said it depends on a) how much you produce & b) You might want a dedicated head? It not unusual to have dedicated stripper (head).

2. I don't see a definitive design for a gin still, is just simple pot still the way to go, keg, short column to hold botanicals, bend, condenser, collect gin.
Ans: Yes indeed. Its principally a stripper (with/without a basket)

3. On youtube iStill is banging on about putting botanicals in the wash.
Ans: Do you mean the wash (fermenting with bots? or right before stripping?)? Link?

There is no one way ( actually theres 3 ). Infused IMO pull old the darker flavours and each recipe MUST include time and be reinvented for various volumes. A basket will pull finer flavours, cleaner and more complex. I particularly like that it is scalable. Testing a recipe on 1 litre batch, DIRECTLY scales to a 10 litre batch, making SWIMBO's gin consistent. Happy Wife Happy Life.

There are 3 main ways
Cold infused for 1 - 2 week
This typically makes more dark flavour Gins - but needs more weight of botanical matter. Costs more. This is method used for Odins easy gin. No scalable.


Hot maceration
You redistil a neutral spirit, with the botanicals in it. The boiling action releases the oils which are carried into the gin.
Quicker than a cold infused method. Potentially uses less botanical matter less but more risky.

Steaming
The basic idea here is to have a basket somewhere in the vapour trail.
You redistill a neutral spirit which passes through the botanicals. And the lovely flavoursome gin trickles out of the still.
This method is much quicker, has the potential to use less botanical matter and is less risk.
The big attraction, of course, is that it is scalable. One bottle or 5 L. The recipe does not need to be reinvented.


4. Is it best to make gin with strip in the boiler or finished spirit in the boiler, I read about making cuts but if you are using spirit in the boiler surely you don't need to make cuts as it has been cut already.
Ans: Finished spirit IMO - again improves consistency.

5. Where is the line drawn in regards to what is a gin, surely some of these craft gin's are actually flavoured vodka if juniper is not prominent.
Ans: Probably the biggest debate. Depends which side of the fence you pitch up...you could argue whiskey starts off as vodka and it too is just a subset [CoweringUnderDeskEmoji]

Gin IMO is a specific flavoured Vodka! Dry gin is like Ed mentioned Juniper, Coriander and Angelica. Worth noting at this point you want a pinch of Angelica (and probably Orris root) in all recipes - is the fixative, else after a couple of weeks your gin will fade.

If you fancy some reading "sputnik" in the search box will keep you busy for a couple of mins.

Whats she like? We can probably come up with the recipe.

[RumJohn]

@ Mash. Re #5. That answer is wrong. Whiskey does not start out as vodka. There is no argument.

[Maker]

Thanks guys I feel enlightened as usual, I will build another head just for gin, I've had a rummage and I think I have enough bits without spending much at all, gives me an excuse to fire the welder up.
I have a 50l boiler and the column will stay at 2" so how long should I make the botanicals basket and can I simply chop up an old seive to make the basket (30 mesh)?
Heres the link to Istill, I will admit I diddn't watch all of it, his voice got to me and I think he loves himself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjWgS4REEQw&t=311s he talks about the benefits of adding botanicals to the wash.
I'll get it built in the next couple of days and we can talk more on what's next, I think most questions are answered and plenty of extra info to think about, do you guys have a place you order botanicals from or just eBay?
As for what does her in charge like, I think something citrus, fresh, sharp and a touch fruity would suit well.

Mash, you need to sort Rum John out, he has been circling my house on his BMX all night shouting rude words, he is itching for a punch up, pretty sure I saw some nunchucks so watch out.

[Mash]

@ Mash. Re #5. That answer is wrong. Whiskey does not start out as vodka. There is no argument.

[Easydrinker]

Sometimes in the excitement/rush of tapping a post, we overlook something/make a mistake.
I have done so more than once.
Putting your hands up when called out is generally the best response.
This one has played out with humor.
I think all honor is satisfied.
No need for pistols at dawn.

Robert.

[Klunk]

Gin is only Gin if it has the predominance of Juniper in it's botanical envelope, everything else is down to choice though the usual triumverate of Gin is Juniper, Coriander and Angelica but it must be Juniper dominant.

*Gets off high horse to find a bacon sarnie*

[Mash]

*Gets off high horse to find a bacon sarnie*

LOL.

No need for pistols at dawn.

There was never a need for pistols at dawn - nothing was called out - unless you mean I didn't use the right emoji

[Klunk]

No Mash, only joshing and following RumJohn's lead

[Easydrinker]

@ Mash. Re #5. That answer is wrong. Whiskey does not start out as vodka. There is no argument.

THAT is being called out, at least in my world.
I thought your choice of emoji reflected your acknowledgement?
Maybe I am missing something here?


Robert.

[Maker]

If it's a grain spirit surely it is just vodak before it gets oaked, am I missing something?

I havent abandonded this post, I will report back with a write up and pictures of the gin head once done, life has been getting in the way and I ran out of argon.
Another couple of hours in the workshop and we should be getting close.

A couple of questions if I may, I'm making a simple design, short column then a 180 bend and a product condensor, is it best to place the gin basket at the top of the column or after the 180 bend so on top of the condensor?

I looked at still dragons gin basket and it looks like any condensed flavour made in the basket would not be collected as it would drip down in to the waste, only air bourn flavours would make it home, is there a reason not to collect flavour that drips off the basket?
https://www.stilldragon.eu/en/search?controller=search&orderby=position&orderway=desc&search_query=gin+basket&submit_search=

[Myles]

I will just add a few things.

Gin is not always grain based, it can be grape based and also sugar based.

The first distilled product of grain is whisky. If you subsequently clean out more flavour you can get vodka.

Methods - one that I am in favour of but that is not mentioned much is to make your gin rig a thumper. You but your botanicals in the thumper or in a basket over the thumper. That way your primary pot still only ever contains clean spirit.

I like Genever - a type of gin that includes a malted component.

[Mash]

Myles do you have a recipe please. I have struggled to find a good one.

Ed. The key word for me was "could" I was being quite literal not stating a fact. It is certainly a big debate I have seen elsewhere. It think it probably depends on if your views are chemistry, destillery, legislative or marketing biased. I think it's all a load of cogeners

[Myles]

@mash not a recipe as such, I have compiled some recipes that i just posted here.

http://www.stillsmart.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4831