Yeast Bomb

[Mash]

Doubt it. if you are only adding a cup or 2.

[chill]

After taking the curd off I will add the yeast with a bit of sugar in the yogurt maker which should be an easy way to make a starter. I will then add it to the hot sugar water mix in the 7.57lt jug up to 7.5lt actual fill.

That is what I was reacting too. Yoghurt is tart, not sure about the remaining whey.

[Mash]

Would lob it all in (25l) and then sprinkle not be easier?

[RumJohn]

@ Ant: Proceed with caution, show restraint, be patient and GO FOR IT. There is no reason to be nervous. About the worst you could do is stuff the run up and have to chuck it out. But that is not likely to happen.

I do feel that you are making this a whole lot more complicated than it needs to be. Learn to make something simple and as you learn, if the desire is there, then get more complicated in your approach. In the interim, keep it simple and different aspects will start making sense.

[RumJohn]

@ Packapoo:

Ahhh RJ...
I'm presently doing a head scratch as my pot stilling experiences in producing a whisky gave me a crystal clear, but brown toned product. I never questioned this as it was what I was expecting. Now I discover I'm at odds with the world and trying to savvy why?
I did smoke my base product - weetbix and all-bran and wonder whether that may've been the factor.
The end result worked for me and I'm happy.....just puzzled

Mate: What comes out of your still should be crystal clear. If there is some sort of colour showing it will be because the system puked a bit of wash into it, or more likely, your equipment is dirty.

I wash out my fermentation tanks and boilers, etc., but I scrub out my still prior to a spirit run. My washes are practically black. A very dark brown anyway, which comes from the molasses. However, no colour comes across.

[packapoo]

Thanks RJ.
I've accepted what I didn't know regarding distillate colour. Clarity has never been an issue...

I'm confident puking and dirty equipment weren't culprits either as I learned early on how to avoid the puke, plus have a rigid regime for both boiler and still cleaning.

After I hot smoked the Weetbix and All Bran I used for the wash I was left with an extremely disgusting looking mess that had a sort of greasy look about it, but it all fermented out well. Even gave it a late caramel hit for something extra.....

One thing's for sure, the rum washes are very dark brown, almost black, similar to your description so will be an interesting learning experience. Be keen to see boiler innards following but not expecting any nasty surprises. (Can't see a fingers crossed icon to use......)

[ant]

The whey is 4.5. My tapwater is 7. I have maybe 500ml of whey. Not measured it yet.
Yogurt is tart becuase it takes so long to reach the shelves. It is not tart when freshly made.

The yogurt maker keeps nicely warm very easily. It should be easy to make a 15 min one litre starter half whey half water with a bit of sugar. unless the ph is too acidic? 5.75 at a halfway guess. Does sugar effect ph?

The jug is a smaller batch to experiment with. It also gives a higher nutrient concentration from a given amount of whey. Gives the whey a best first chance to work. And I'd like to know if good insulation can replace external heating. Vacuum is pretty good.

[chill]

Thanks for the yoghurt information, I learned something today which makes it a good day. Sugar should be pH neutral, 4.5 seems ok for a yeast starter. Perhaps a tad low, but not enough to worry me.

[ant]

Thanks. Half and half should be fine then.

Yeah you should try it tresh at least once. It's really creamy and nice. Not tart at all.

This batch only partially seperated so I used a large coffee filter to drain the whey and keep the yogurt out. Its how greek style set yogurt is made. Proper nice fresh.

Will try a ferment shortly.

[ant]

A study that looks at the destruction of B1 & B2 considering factors of temp, time, moisture & ph.

It's a bit grim as they use the growth or not of chicks as their litmus for B vit destruction so you might just want to scroll down to the conclusions at the bottom. Grain and malt both get an honourable mention as superior sources of vit B. Liver also gets mentioned. Most of it is done with bakers yeast or yeast extract.

Essentially vit B1 is almost indestructable dry at 100deg C. Wet it takes many hours to be destroyed unless it is in an alkaline solution. An acidic solution adds protection against destruction. B2 is more easily destroyed by heat even dry but they are still looking at 24-144 hours not minutes. The other B vits may vary but enthusiastic cooks appear to be neglecting the time and other factors and so overestimating the sensitivity of B vits to heat. Pantothenic acid seems the most vulnerable. That's why you were all smashing it in practice despite some theories.
http://www.jbc.org/content/99/1/309.full.pdf
Here is a food/nutrition page that troubled to look at the science.
http://www.beyondveg.com/tu-j-l/raw-cooked/raw-cooked-2e.shtml
The university of Utah states here that B12 resists breakdown even at boiling temps for several hours. Despite some cooking sites describing it as the heat sensitive B vit.
http://healthcare.utah.edu/healthlibrary/related/doc.php?type=19&id=vitaminb-12
Turns out my yogurt maker maintains about 38 deg C.

[Easydrinker]

Nice one ant, background reading assembled in one place.
I just love your doggedness,(Is that a real word?)

Robert.

[ant]

I think doggedness would pass the suzie dent test.

Throughout the following I used only a kitchen pad and water to maintain clean kitchen standards. No sterilisation. Cleaning inside the jug the water was boiling; three rinse and scrubs.

I dissolved a little sugar in 150ml of water at 35degC and added it to 500ml of whey also at 35degC. I put it in the yogurt maker, with 7.5g of yeast sprinkled and whisked, which slowly brought it up to 38deg C. During this time nothing much seemed to happen so I brought it up to a litre thinking it may be a little acidic.

Meanwhile I dissolved 1.5kg of sugar in 3lt of boiling water and then added 3.5lt of cold. It was a little warm so I left it with the lid off for an hour or so until it came down to 35degC.

I checked the litre in the yogurt pot and still nothing much seemed to have happened but I shrugged and added it to the jug and put the lid on. Left the little stopper in the lid a bit loose. Wen't to see mum and checked it about seven hours later. I more than half expected to be asking you guys what I had done wrong but to my suprise there were distinct signs of bubbles taking place. No foam or crust but there was active life in there. Put the lid back and will check again tomoz.

Very little head room and small surface as it is in the neck of the jug. May become a problem?
Any comments?

[ant]

Checked it yesterday.

Still only a little activity. Temp was down to 24degC so not enough activity to maintain temp. Ph had plummeted to 3.5 so something happening. Used bicarb to raise ph to 5.1

Much the same this morning. Not dead but certainly no yeast monster. I drew samples from the bottom just to make sure the readings at the top were typical ofthe batch. They are. Ph had dropped again to 4.5. I added a little bicarb again just up to 4.7. May be some measurement error yesterday as I only checked the top. Maybe not though.

I'm almost ready to declare whey as a non starter.

Perhaps I should have boiled it first to make sure the yogurt bacteria were dead. Maybe a compitition of some kind going on but they live off fat not sugar so seems unlikely.

Half a litre in seven litres seems like it had a fair chance if it was going to work.

Any thoughts?

And for the record I do know when I make puns. I just go with deadpan to let them stand or fall on their own.

[RumJohn]

@ Ant: You are not the first to waste so much time screwing around but I would venture to say you have made things more complicated for yourself than anybody else.

Why??

[Mash]

I can come out of the closet now then. I thought that but didn't want to say.

I was all for just lob it in...