Recycling yeast

[spot]

I speak as someone who has started his first ferment. You may expect all sorts of nonsense from me.

The yeast I bought says Turbo on the packet. I thought it was a good idea because it includes "nutrients", whatever they are. I'd be interested to know what, besides sugar, a yeast might need.

The pack went into a tub of 6kg granulated white Tate and Lyle dissolved in 23 litres of warm tapwater. I don't know how to oxygenate that. I did put a lid on the tub. Not a lot has happened in the first 24 hours. I'm aiming at 14% a.b.v. according to the yeast pack, but I skipped the last 2 litres to leave some headroom.

I've taken the top off and applied a few minutes of an electric whisk. The lid is now resting loosely rather than pressed down. Does that qualify as oxygenating?

From what I can gather reading threads here, making a starter with all the yeast in more dilute sugar is a good thing. It's like building a fire with twigs instead of trying to light logs.

If I reach a point where no sugar remains I'll be surprised, but we'll see. The question I was getting round to is can I just use a pint of what I get as the yeast for the next ferment, or must I use fresh yeast? If I can use the existing stuff, what nutrients will it be missing?

Educational comments on bits I didn't know I should ask about will all be welcome.

[Anavrin]

Hi Spot and welcome

Turbo yeast normally set off quite quickly if used in the right conditions, sounds like your whisking will be enough to oxygenate your wash, two things might be stopping it fermenting, firstly the yeast could have been dud, but that's easily solved by adding more, the nutrients from the first turbo will still be in the bucket so you could just add some cheap bread yeast to get it going.

Secondly you said you used warm tap water, generally if it feels warm, it's too hot for the yeast to survive, did you use a thermometer to check the temperature before adding the yeast?

In which case just ensure it's somewhere around 25°c and add half a tin of Allinsons bread yeast to get it going.

I'd also put the lid back on with an airlock, the bubbles are the easiest way to see if it's fermenting.

[spot]

I checked with a digital thermometer and it was 25°C when the yeast went in. The tub has since been on a heatmat and hasn't exceeded 28°C. There's no control or I'd turn the mat down a bit.




Blimey.

Okay, I did that. I took 125g dried Allinsons - actually Doves Farm - out of the fridge and stirred it to approximately liquid in a pint of water. I took the lid off the tub and it all seemed placid enough so I poured the pint in.

I imagine the first second or two in an engine at Cape Kennedy gives much the same impression of limitless power suddenly directed upward and outward. I panicked. I put the lid back on and clipped it home all round. The water in the bubbler screamed as it hit the ceiling. There's a pint of froth which I might try mopping from above my head in a bit. Some of it is in my hair.

We seem to have started the ferment.

[gaza the instructor]

You could say it almost went off in
your hand

[spot]

I've no idea what it's like in there now but the temperature in the tub has gone up another two degrees since I turned off the heatmat, and the bubbler could power a small wind generator at the moment.

Anyway - had everything been ideal and worked predictably, could I then have used a pint of the fermented contents to do a second batch? What nutrient would I require along with the new sugar if it's feasible?

[gaza the instructor]

Fermentation causes heat mate.
its not that cold indoors ATM.

[Easydrinker]

Sorry to laugh at your misfortune, but I haven't smiled so much at a post on this site for a long while, you reported it in a very good way.
To make amends, I shall attempt to answer your question about re using yeast.
Yes, you can reuse yeast from the trub of your wash with varying amounts of success.
Some of the nutrient needed can be added with a little DAP maybe
But as you saw from your addition of bread yeast, which is cheap, you do not need a Turbo; and other neutral washes such as Kale and Lentil, along with many others, provide nutrient enough already.
The best threads for this are probably in this section, there may be a few in Recipes.

ATB
Robert.

[Icefever]

The bit about Cape Kennedy made I chuckle....I was there once for one of the shuttle launches...and as I've had a similar thing happen over the years with beer/wine.

One thing to learn about washes Spot is you don't need the lid snapped down tight...just lay it on top for the first day or so, when the yeast monster as gone, pop it down...there's so much Co2 coming off of the wash in that state that nothing is going to get in for the first 24/48 hours.

ps...Is the avatar of you??? if not your ok...if it is I would change it to protect yourself....better safe than sorry.

[Mash]

.

ps...Is the avatar of you??? if not your ok...

For a moment there ICE, I thought that was a chat up line :-)

[Curmudgeon]

Turbo yeast is a yeast that can withstand heat variance, high alcohol levels and has nutrient included.

Most experienced folk say that the high levels of nutrient overstimulate the yeast and stress it, leading to dodgy tastes and smells, which then require carbon filtering to remove or reduce.

Bakers yeast is good to maybe 14% which is plenty for our purposes. E1116/1118 wine yeast is I believe what is used in many turbos.

Plenty of wash recipes on here using lentils/kale/tomato puree/boiled yeast from last wash as nutrient.

[spot]

The assorted comments have been useful, I thank you all.

DAP is a new TLA for my collection, I now have a kilo ordered on eBay for £13.98. It looked like the mono-ammonium is cheaper than the di-ammonium but presumably it has less effect, so DAP is what I got.

Browsing suggests vitamin B1 so I might crush a half dozen of the daily multivitamin supplement which keeps me brazen and throw them in with the spoon of DAP.

I reckon the lower price of sucrose over dextrose balances the extra alcohol content of the 23% yeast over the 14% and I'd prefer to work out what I'm doing with the more forgiving lower alcohol combination, and seeing what recycled yeast will do.

I have a theory that my freezer will take up to 24 one-litre open pots (4 pint HDPE supermarket milk containers cut to below the handle) and freeze out just water overnight to leave 25% a.b.v. to distill. Has anyone experience of freeze concentration? I think I'll reach a stable -17°C.

The avatar is me. I've been repeatedly told I'm indistinguishable from every other pointless shed-owning geezer in the world so maybe I'll not get recognized. Nobody looks twice when you're this far past your use-by date.

[Mash]

Welcome to the forum. I do like your view On things. In particular the bit about being indistinguishable from every other pointless shed-owning geezer.

Freezing does work. I have been very pleased with it.
Try this viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4355&p=39343&hilit=Freeze#p39343

[Curmudgeon]

The 20%+ yeast aka turbo 48 will give you horrible smells and flavours. Most similar yeasts will also have nutrient built in and may potentially stress the yeast (think lsd)

E1118 is a good brewing yeast, allinsons bread yeast will do fine and alcotec vodka star is among the better turbos with built in nutrient.

In my limited experience, staying with 14% abv or less is smart. That generally means maybe 5 kilos of sugar per 23 litres and not the suggested 6 kilos.

edit : I have freeze distilled some cider into applejack but it really needs more room and timing than I have.

[Easydrinker]

If everyone that joined this site learned as quickly as Curmudgeon then I would be
redundant

Robert.

[gaza the instructor]

Easydrinker we cant afford your pension
Mr Green did a runner took all the assets
all that's left are some dodgy pink lamp
shades.