Too much sugar - Newbie

[MrHodge]

Hi all, I have an Alcotec 5 gallon 21% vodka kit on the go (first time with spirits but have done a lot of wine). Unfortunately I put too much sugar in it and now it has stopped fermenting at 1003 gravity (original gravity was 1130) and tastes sweet. I have read that there are methods of saving it like starting a second brew and then mixing it 50/50 with the stuck brew to get the last bit of sugar fermented but I have been thinking about getting an AirStill anyway and I wondered if this route would save my wash? So I would take my wash at the current (too sweet) gravity of 1003, rack-off, add carbon, finings etc and then use it in an AirStill. Would this work? Would the still process remove the sweetness or would that remain? Thanks in advance for any advice.

[Icefever]

First of all...welcome to the forum Mr Hodge.

Ok where to start..I've worked out with a sg of 1.130...a fg of 1.003 you have a low wine at about 16%. I've run sugar wash's at around 1.000 even near your 1.003.

Now these vodka kits do not give you any vodka at all....what they give you is 16% colourless, tasteless wine....sorry, but until you have a still that you can run a wash you won't get 80%/90% spirit. Beer and wine are fermented, distillation gives you a whole new world of spirits.

IMHO I would get a Airstill or T500 tomorrow or as soon as possible, your wash will be ok as long as you don't lift the lid...the co2 will keep it safe for a while.

[Mash]

Bang on Ice. Just run it.

[MrHodge]

Thanks for the advice - I've come to the same conclusion - now I just need to decide whether its the Airstill or T500. I've seen a few threads discussing it, so I'll take a look. I did read somewhere that the airstill should only be used with a mash using Triple Distilled Yeast - which I don't think my vodka kit used... does this matter?

[Icefever]

I did read somewhere that the airstill should only be used with a mash using Triple Distilled Yeast - which I don't think my vodka kit used... does this matter?

That's a new one on me mate...when I started off with the airstill I followed the 3xA4 sheets of info that came with it. I thought this is great, then sat down with a nice glass of nail polish...

There is so much crap surrounding these Airstills....you say you've read up on the A/Still & 500 good...now read it again, it'll all drop into place as you learn.

All of us here are ready to help you down the road on your new hobby....so please just ask...we don't do like some forums, we were all newbies once.

[chill]

That Triple Distilled Yeast thing is just the marketers trying to sell more product. A still is a still is a still. You can, and I do!, run anything through it. Whiskey, whisky, rum, brandy, grappa, etc, I have made them al in that simple little still. But if Vodka is your goal, the T500 might suit better.

[MrHodge]

Thanks Ice and Chill. My main tipple will be Vodka and Gin but I will also need to try some cream liquor to keep the wife happy. I have just read the PDF guidance on the AirStill - excellent. It talks about the Tails - how do you know when the tails are present? Why is the T500 better for vodka? Is it just that it gets more impurities out which are easier to spot in Vodka or am I talking rubbish?

[Mash]

Triple Distilled Yeast

Cobblers.

Like the guys have already said there is a lot of rubbish out there. The air still seems to attract it's a fair share. It is a very capable still.

If you are interested in gin check out the sputnik thread...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3768&p=30303&hilit=Sputnik#p30303

[chill]

Before you spend money, do more reading until you can recite the differences between a fractionating aka reflux still and a pot still. The T500 is the former and the AirStill the latter. A T500 will get you to a higher level of ethanol purity but in doing so will remove almost all of the flavour. That is excellent for vodka, but not for rum, whiskies, brandies and such.

Gin is made from a vodka (or close to neutral tasting base), and on a fractionating still, with a "gin basket" on the output before condensation. However; I don't think the T500 column can be setup to produce gin. There is an alternate pot still head for it (you need to buy it as an additional item) but I don't know if it can be used for gin production either.

For a very simple still with minimal controls, the AirStill is remarkable versatile in what it can produce. It is a very solid platform for learning on. BUT it is never going to produce world class vodka. You need a different sort of still for that. With carbon filtering it can produce decent vodka (well, I guess that depends on how finicky you are).

Chuck

[RumJohn]

@ MrHodge: Your wash stopped fermenting because the alcohol content reached a point where it killed off the yeast. I estimate you have in developed in excess of 15% ABV. Splendid. You will have wasted some sugar that is non fermentable but that is no problem. Correct that in the next wash. Do not attempt to get this wash fermenting again. It wont work.

Go ahead and do a stripping run. That will give you what is referred to as a "low wine". Follow that first run up with a "spirit run" or two, depending on your equipment, to achieve a "high wine" that is as close to 95-96% ABV as you can get for a vodka or gin.

[Easydrinker]

MrHodge
Welcome.
The boys have done a good job in welcoming you to this site.
You can run any old shit through an air still and obtain good results.
You can run a good wash through one, a couple of times and obtain outstanding ones.
Bear in mind that the air still is a version of a pot still, and so will work better with a flavoured spirit than a T500, which will produce a more neutral "Vodka" result.
Carbon filtering,pray don't use carbon before, will produce a decent neutral from an air still.
If you have questions then ask, but there is a lot of knowledge in the archives.


Robert.

[Icefever]

Thanks Ice and Chill. My main tipple will be Vodka and Gin but I will also need to try some cream liquor to keep the wife happy. I have just read the PDF guidance on the AirStill - excellent. It talks about the Tails - how do you know when the tails are present? Why is the T500 better for vodka? Is it just that it gets more impurities out which are easier to spot in Vodka or am I talking rubbish?

At the moment your thinking of which still to buy...myself and a number of guys on here started off with the A/still. I see my first one in my local HB shop and purchased one that same day....about 6/9 months later I ordered a 500.

My reason for this was basic time restraints...work, allotment, shopping there was not enough hours over a weekend. I find it's better (for me) to run a 25L wash in one go than running 25L through my A/S. There are members on here who work wonders with their A/S, and are happy to take the time, this is "one mans meat yadder yadder"

You say Vodka & Gin are your tipples...to make a good neutral (Vodka & Gin) you will need a reflux still. As some of the guys have said the A/S is a pot still.

I hope the following does not come across as Granny, suck & eggs

Basically a reflux still is a boiler with a colunm with a condenser fitted. When the charge starts to boil the vapour starts up the colunm, hits the condenser as it can't make it's way out (due to the cold water) it falls back down the colunm, mixing with the rising vapours...this is the "reflux"...this is what your after, we're all different, I go for around 15/20 mins. Then I start to back off the water..I place my hand on the upper part of the condenser, not the colunm I can then feel the heat start to enter the PC and the first drips of neutral will run.


Tails... you will have to learn this by smell and taste...which ever still you use it's best to collect in small batch's from the start. Cover with paper towel, leave over night to air (angels share). This is where you smell & taste each jar, it's all down to your taste buds now.
Lots of guys say tails smell of wet cardboard or dog...but when you have a couple of runs under your belt it'll come.

One last thing to consider is money.. an A/S is around £160 the 500 is £380...you have to think would the £160 be better spent on a 500??? only you can say With an home made gin basket...and maybe make a pothead like Vino, the best of both worlds...reflux & pot.


I can't remember the last time I used my A/S

Hope this helps.

[Mash]

You say Vodka & Gin are your tipples...to make a good neutral (Vodka & Gin) you will need a reflux still.

Sorry Ice. You know I disagree with that statement.
To make any spirit you need a good wash. To use a well worn please.. Crap in crap out. Fermenting a good wash will produce a good almost neutral spirit in an AS.

I will not disagree that a reflux produces a better neutral.. But how neutral does it need to be of you are adding more flavour.
It's about balance. Cost/quality/time. And getting the best bang for you buck.

And on that last one 'time' I thoroughly, utterly and absolutely believe that time "you spent on it " is much greater once you add water to the cooling process. The end to end process will be quicker but you have got to be in attendance.

Balance.

[Icefever]

You say Vodka & Gin are your tipples...to make a good neutral (Vodka & Gin) you will need a reflux still.

Sorry Ice. You know I disagree with that statement.
To make any spirit you need a good wash. To use a well worn please.. Crap in crap out. Fermenting a good wash will produce a good almost neutral spirit in an AS.

That's ok mate..perhaps that was a wee bit of a wide general statement..because when I started off with an A/S I did do a passable neutral..As we've said early last week..crap in crap out

I will not disagree that a reflux produces a better neutral.. But how neutral does it need to be of you are adding more flavour.
It's about balance. Cost/quality/time. And getting the best bang for you buck.

I'm after the best neutral I can get...for me I don't add flavouring, and if it costs a couple of quid more C'est la vie

And on that last one 'time' I thoroughly, utterly and absolutely believe that time "you spent on it " is much greater once you add water to the cooling process. The end to end process will be quicker but you have got to be in attendance.

Balance.

Very true Mash when I do run the still I enjoy the whole time spent..no matter how long.

[MrHodge]

Great forum guys - thanks for the welcome and great advice. I think I am going to start with the Air Still and see how I get on. One further question - when doing a stripping run the best practice suggests running until the ABV is down to 20% - how can you tell this? Do you catch it in small 100mm jars with an alcometer to read it? Presumably you can note the time it takes to get down to 20% then do it by time for subsequent runs of the same batch of wash?