Moved Alan Manning still discussion

[Icefever]

Cooling the bottom of a packed section is a bad idea and it disrupts the thermal gradient.
The entire principle is to establish a gradient with hot at the boiler end and cooler at the top end. Also, the cross tube reflux condenser is the least effective of any of the reflux condenser designs.

I did tell myself not to get involved with this thread....but I do have a strong feeling to do so now.
I've only been doing this for what? 6 maybe 7 years or so. In that time I've learnt a lot about stilling, I've built a couple of columns, a thumper, run a number of washes.
Turned out what I and others think is good likker, flavoured rums that Mrs Ice & I prefer, Vodka etc etc.

I agree with Myles about the lower cooling pipe, why would you want to cool the vapour at that stage when you want the vapour to rise through whatever packing you use, then when it hits the top cold finger or whatever you have fitted, cool and run back down????
That is what we want from our still, this is what we are aiming for.....

Ok, we all had to start somewhere with this hobby of ours, but what really piss's me off is when guys with the experience try to point those that have not, the better way of doing something.

I found a Youtube channel for Alan Manning,.....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jw7Unu1uyFg

Draw your own conclusions.....that's my 2 cents worth.

[Myles]

OK it is a 28 mm column packed with ceramic beads which I will be generous with and equate to 6 mm Raschig rings (RR=6)

At 800 mm packed length your maximum practical power will be 400 watts. It doesn`t matter if you reflux ratio is 6 or 60 you will not get higher than 92%.

Drop your packing to 300 mm (is it as much as that?) and you drop to 82%

All this assumes that your reflux condenser (the cooling tubes) is capable of extracting enough energy to produce the required volume of reflux condensate.

1000w generates 52 ml/minute. At a reflux ratio of 6 this is product at 7.4 ml per minute. Reduce this to 400w and that is 3 ml per minute.

In comparison the PDA1 with an equally short 12 inch (but wider diameter) mesh packed (RR=4) column will produce flavoured product at 35 to 60 ml per minute (on 1500 watts) and vodka at 7.5 ml per minute (on 750 watts) Fast enough to dilute to one bottle of vodka per hour.

There are significant advantages to be had - even on short columns - of increasing the diameter.

I am just saying that you could make something much better for the same price. Throw out the packing and it will make a not bad pot still. It is expensive though for what you are getting.

[Duffer26]

I haven't read PDA1, but it either can't be relied on or the next paragraph makes me a liar. You decide.

The AM still works. It produces 96% vodka with no off flavours, admittedly, with some work. I use 6mm raschig rings up to the top pipe and then copper mesh to the top. I use a 1500w hot plate as a heat source.

I'm happy to answer any questions.

Marc.

[Easydrinker]

Duffer mate, chill a little.
No one is calling you a liar.
People coming back with advise and opinions is just that.

The reason a forum exists? Methinks?

I know that Myles thinks my continued use of various air cooled stills is bonkers and/or eccentric.
It doesn't put the two of us at loggerheads, we just respect each others (and others) approaches to distilling.

This site was founded for the basic Air Still user, which for many is all that is needed.

Read my signature.

Robert.

[Myles]

Just an opinion Duffer, if it works for you then there is no problem. There are always multiple ways to do anything. Just look at all the combinations of LM, VM and CM reflux columns. There has been a huge amount of development in the last 20 years.

VikingEyes asked a question that I tried to answer. Perhaps you should describe your running method with the AM still for his benefit, to help him make up his mind. Do you do strip and spirit runs, how many times, boiler ABV charges - that sort of thing.

I have made vodka on a pot still but it took multiple runs - it was faster and used less power on a packed column. I ended up though using that packed column just to make neutral instead, and that took more than 1 run.

As for the air cooled option, eccentric possibly, but I have used it myself in the past, and still have a 1 inch spiral still that will probably get incorporated into my next pot still build.

There are no wrong methods - some are just a bit more convenient than others.

[Duffer26]

I keep threatening to make a 'AM still walk through' but two children under 5 always seem to selfishly trump anything I want to do. I haven't even made vodka for months.

I'll at least take some photos or a video the next time I run.

Regards, Marc.