Who has made UJSSM

[Dave]

Just as a matter of interest, Anavrin, I'm guessing you're just using the corn for flavour, as there's nothing in your recipe that will convert the starches into fermentable sugars. Am I right, or have I missed something?

[Anavrin]

Hi Dave

Yes the corn is for flavour, it adds a noticeable amount, even to the first strip, and at that point it's not even a sour mash yet, the sourness comes from adding backset from each strip back into the fermenter for the next generation.

I've never made anything like it before but it's been massively popular over many years in the states and around the world, I decided it was my turn to have a go and see what all the fuss was about.

It's quite ingenious in that you only ever have to add yeast once when you first start, after that it's a case of keeping it alive while you strip one batch and create the backset needed to add to the next batch.

[Anavrin]

Now on to my third generation after stripping the second, just hope the yeast lives again, the backset was still quite hot when I added it to the fermenter.

[Anavrin]

Now preparing to go to the 4th generation, this is where many people who have made this before, agree that it gets better as a sour mash, I'm going to tweek the recipe slightly for my own purpose of creating a Bourbon style spirit.

A typical Bourbon mash consist of 70-80% corn plus barley and rye in varying amounts, so far I have only used corn in my sour mash, so I'm just about to mash 3kg of barley and 3kg of malted rye in the Grainfather, once mashed and cooled I will add this to my fermenter after I've siphoned the contents into my Still for stripping and replaced the spent corn, this will keep my yeast alive and give them something to do while I strip my wash.

Once the wash is stripped, I'll add 10 litres of backset and a couple of bags of sugar for the forth generation to ferment.

I'm getting about 8 litres of strip per generation, so I will soon have around 32 litres for a spirit run.

Then I will continue as before for the next three generations with only corn, until the forth, when I will add barley and rye again as before.

I'm looking forward to the spirit run, more forward to something the taste like Bourbon once it ages on some oak.

[Anavrin]

Well it kind of went tits up today, had a real fight with the Grainfather, 3kgs of barley and 3kgs of malted rye in 20 litres of water is a sticky stuck mash disaster!

I didn't even get to strip my 3rd generation, it's in the Still so I'll have to do it soon, I've added my barley and rye wort to the corn in the fermenter for it to get going, the backset will have to be added at a later date.

[Anavrin]

I've decided to have a little change of plan, rather than do a spirit run off 4 generations, I'm going to do one every three, so my first spirit will be a straight UJSSM, and the second spirit run will be a full sour mash made from the grain and rye in the first sour mash followed by two more batches of just corn and sugar for my Bourbon style UJSSM.

Three reasons for this

Firstly I want to know what normal UJSSM is like

Secondly my boiler capacity is 40 litres at 30% and this is equal to three strips at 50%

Thirdly my sour mash will be fully developed by the 4th generation, the one I've added the grain to, there will still be some residue from the grain in the next two generations, hopefully helping me in my way to my Bourbon Dream

[Anavrin]

Last Weekend I run my first 3 generations that I'd previously stripped as a spirit run with 2 x 4" bubble plates, I collected as follows


UJSM run notes
27/11/2016

40litre charge at 30%
3kw power
2 x pro cap plates
Big baby dephlagmator on full flow throughout

Jar. ABV. Temp. Size Type T Coll
1. 88. 80.1. 500ml. Fores 440ml
2. 88. 80.1. 1000ml. Heads 880ml
3. 88. 80.1. 1000ml. Heads 880ml
4. 88. 80.1. 1000ml. Heads 880ml
5. 87.5. 80.2. 1000ml. Heads 875ml
6. 87.5 80.2. 500ml. Hearts 437ml
7. 87.5 80.2. 500ml. Hearts 437ml
8. 87.5. 80.2. 500ml. Hearts 437ml
9. 87.5. 80.2 500ml. Hearts 437ml
10. 87.5. 80.2. 500ml. Hearts 437ml
11. 87. 80.3. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
12. 87. 80.3. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
13. 87. 80.3. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
14. 87. 80.3. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
15. 87. 80.4. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
16. 87. 80.4. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
17. 87. 80.5. 500ml. Hearts 435ml
18. 86.5. 80.5. 500ml. Tails 432.5ml
19. 86.5. 80.7. 500ml. Tails 432.5ml
20. Increased power to 3500w
21. 86. 81.2. 1000ml. Tails
22. 84. 82.4. 1000ml. Tails


Made my cuts today and I used everything from Jar 6 to jar 19, and now have just over 8 litres at cask strength, aging on oak.

I can now see why this is so popular, it's without doubt a Whisky, slightly sweeter as you can taste the corn slightly but it's very similar to aged grain whisky when unaged.

My next two generations will be stripped and combined with the 6 litres of feints from this run, it's supposed to get better after the 4th generation and I'm impressed to say the least with the results from the first 3.

[Leatherman]

So I made my first UJSM not UJSSM, because its first and no backwash was used yet. Did it with 4kg sugar and 4kg of frozen sweet corn. Mixed corn and sugar with hot tap water and left it for a night. For conrs to defrost. Next day pitched simple brewing east, citric acid and east nutrients. Fermentation was very powerfull. Some of it even came out from air lock on the floor. But now it stopped. And I my question is. Corns are still flowting on top. Is it normal and should I wait for them to go down or no? Its 30 litre mash

Many thanks for answers!

[Anavrin]

Hi Leatherman

Most people only say UJSM for short anayway, I used cracked corn, which is kernels that have been fully dried out, then crushed into 4-5 bits each, only the odd one floats which is easy to pick out,

I’m not sure if frozen sweet corn would be suitable, I assume it’s fresh corn that’s simply been frozen, and once defrosted, it could start to go off!!

Maybe it’ll be ok, but personally I have no experiance with fresh corn. Sorry

[Easydrinker]

I made some frozen sweetcorn washes a few years back.
However I defrosted the corn and liquidised with a blender before using.
It was like fermenting buckets of sunshine.
I did have to sieve as well as rack off, as the bits of skin floated.
It made a very good spirit.
The write up follows, if you want a long read.
Not really an Uncle Jessie.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2709&p=16355&hilit=sweetcorn+wash#p16355

Those were the days! I had forgotten, AM and I bitching all the time.
I merely argued for more ways than one.
I still do.
Robert.

[Myles]

The main reason this is so popular seems to be that it is cheap. In reality this is nothing more than a corn flavoured vodka.

I never bothered with it because there are other options. You can use the same basic principles, multi generation and recycling of backset (which you are supposed to COOL before adding it back into the grain bed that contains live yeast ). It is a bit more expensive but you can substitute LME for some of the sugar.

More grain and less sugar improves the flavour and decreases the yield. That is just the way it is.

A mix of different grain and LME makes a fine whisky. Bourbon is a minimum 51% corn and a little bit too sweet for my taste. I prefer Rye these days. You can stretch it a bit with sugar - you will soon find out which taste profile you prefer.

I don`t go for peated malt whisky these days - but it is worth reading Harry`s classic article on a Glenmorangie clone for pointers.

[Leatherman]

What is LME?

[gaza the instructor]

Myles was going to try running a couple of those
barrel Nos? ss thingys. Have run UJSSM to 9 gens
using backset etc.I used cracked or kibbled corn.
Are you saying could have done better with LME.
Light or dark?
Have you a recipe?
I made 4 gallons in all, aged on wood for 6 months
gave it a little drop of maple, lowered it to 40%
and call it gazza shine.It went down well, looking
to improve my product, your help would be greatfuly
received.

[Easydrinker]

LME is liquid Malt extract.
And for those that don't know how to find this...
download/file.php?id=73
Have a read on me, and Myles!


Robert.

[Myles]

From what I have read on the beer forums over the years, as a general rule.

1 kg of LME is roughly equivalent to 1.3 kg of base malt when it comes to flavour, and
LME is generally about 70% or 72% fermentable.

So basically you can substitute LME for sugar and/or grain as you see fit.

With the sugar/grain combinations - whether they are a UJSM type fermentation or a piggyback after an all grain fermentation - the general rules apply.

Less sugar and more grain increases flavour and decreases yield. Take any recipe, try it, then modify the proportions until it is what you want.

I have been talking with a couple of folks that run UJSSM consistently (or variations of it) and basically in a 150 litre fermenter they aim for a 120 litre fermentation, of which the bottom 20 litres is the grain bed.
It seems fairly common to replace 4 or 5 litres of the grain bed each generation and also to add in 3 x 1.5 kg tins of LME goo as a substitute for 3kg sugar. Apparently if you add the new grain to the hot backset with the sugar and LME you get a better flavour extraction.

Everyone tells me that the floating grain thing is a myth. It is common practice just to scoop off the top of the grain bed and replace it with fresh grain each generation.

Modifying the standard UJSSM to include use of LME and routine addition of hot steeped (cooked?) grain is said to make quite an improvement in the flavour of the product and with mixed grain it is supposed to be a very acceptable whisky after a few generations.